Sunday, 6 June 2021

Have I been playing spontaneous advance wrong? Posted by Vince Cholewa, 2 June 2021

Hi all, I think I have been playing spontaneous advance wrong. How do you play it?
I had treated the bullets as a sequence. That is, if a spontaneously advancing element could not contact an enemy element directly in front, then (1) it had to contact an element by the least change of direction.
If it could not do (1), then it had to (2), moving directly towards enemy baggage or routing enemy within 400 paces.
And so forth sequentially through the bullet points.
However, I now think my sequential reading of the bullet pointed options is wrong. This is because the rules state if a spontaneous element cannot contact enemy by moving straight ahead “... Otherwise it must either:” This seems to mean you can choose any of the bullets.

Your views, please. 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/824840264342234/permalink/1816918658467718/


  • John Edmundson
    I think you've been being unduly hard on yourself, I've always played it as options.
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  • Anthony Reardon
    Since the troops are moving impetuously, out of one's control, we play that you don't have a choice and must follow the first applicable bullet, as you have been doing. (As it's been put to me, if the element clearly has no choice if it can contact enemy directly ahead, why should it then have a choice if enemy are not directly ahead?)
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    • John Edmundson
      Because it says 'it must either'. Impetuous troops aren't necessarily "berserk", as interpreted back in the old days. They're "local commanders following a standard operating procedure not needing an order from a general; or in the extreme case, undisciplined disobedience."There is no reference to them being sequential. If they were, it would be written to specify that.
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    • Anthony Reardon
      Which has been my counter argument, but I was outvoted.
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    • John Edmundson
      Anthony Reardon Not that "a letter from Phil" somewhere here in my pocket is our standard these days, I do remember him making clear that impetuous was no a synonym for 'berko'. It was local chieftains thinking they knew better or whatever. I think that intent is clear in the quote from P30. Diagram 5a does show that "Change direction by the least angle and then move the least distance possible" is to be strictly followed. Beyond that, I see nothing to say the remaining bullet points must be followed in sequence.
      Sometimes the minority view proves to be the correct one. I think this is one of those cases. However Lawrence may come alongand prove me wrong . . .
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  • Vincent Cholewa
    Author
    Admin
    Anthony Reardon and John Edmundson thank you. This is exactly how my thoughts played out. Spontaneous was out of control and should follow the bullets in order. Then, a more careful reading of the rules suggested they gave a choice of any bullet.
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    • Edited
  • Neil Williamson
    It seems very clear to me that there is a choice of 4 actions.
    This is reinforced by the second sentence at the top of the page "This may reflect initiative by local commanders following standard operational procedure...."
    The rule represents local initiatives not battle crazed beserkers.
    The troops have some discretion on what they want to do and i think the rules as written reflect that.
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  • Anthony Reardon
    Looking again at page 49, particularly para F, it indicates that the page 30 bullets are a sequence rather than options. What do you think?
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    • John Edmundson
      I think that refers to bullet point one - "Change direction by the least angle and then move the least distance". So you don't get a free choice within point one over which enemy to target. It doesn't cover what happens beyond point one. In practice, I think the listed order is likely to be the order people follow because it's the best order(!) but I don't think it's mandatory. I just looked at the "Clarifications" document and it says that if a straight ahead move to contact is not possible,"Otherwise (including when a straight ahead move is not possible) choose one of:" and lists the four bullet points. So it seems the hive mind of the DBMM list thinks they're options, not a sequence of priorities.
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  • Vincent Cholewa
    Author
    Admin
    Anthony Reardon and John Edmundson thank you. This is exactly how my thoughts played out. Spontaneous was out of control and should follow the bullets in order. Then, a more careful reading of the rules suggested they gave a choice of any bullet.
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    • Edited
  • Neil Williamson
    It seems very clear to me that there is a choice of 4 actions.
    This is reinforced by the second sentence at the top of the page "This may reflect initiative by local commanders following standard operational procedure...."
    The rule represents local initiatives not battle crazed beserkers.
    The troops have some discretion on what they want to do and i think the rules as written reflect that.
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    • Edited
  • Anthony Reardon
    Looking again at page 49, particularly para F, it indicates that the page 30 bullets are a sequence rather than options. What do you think?
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    • John Edmundson
      I think that refers to bullet point one - "Change direction by the least angle and then move the least distance". So you don't get a free choice within point one over which enemy to target. It doesn't cover what happens beyond point one. In practice, I think the listed order is likely to be the order people follow because it's the best order(!) but I don't think it's mandatory. I just looked at the "Clarifications" document and it says that if a straight ahead move to contact is not possible,"Otherwise (including when a straight ahead move is not possible) choose one of:" and lists the four bullet points. So it seems the hive mind of the DBMM list thinks they're options, not a sequence of priorities.
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